Holly Asks For Commitment: Thanksgiving Follow Up

She very well might ask me to commit after this.  Will she cut it off when, not if, I shut that down?  Who knows.  What I do know is that my frame is strong as fuck with her.  I’m 22, and I’m not willing to give up everything I’ve worked for on my game to commit to her.  Game isn’t a mean to an ends for me, it’s not a game that ends when the first pretty girl wants to settle down with me.  I would love to have her as a primary long-term girlfriend.  See her 2-3 nights a week, do the sleepover and relationship stuff, but still be gaming on the side.

Read my post here to get an idea of what’s going on.

Not more than 24 hours after I wrote that post (I wrote it on Wednesday and published yesterday), I was at sitting at a cocktail bar with Holly.  I had already met her parents, and roughly a dozen of her friends in her hometown.  As I’m leaning back on the couch and sipping a gin and tonic, she remarks to me…

“You’re sitting on this couch in the middle of a bar like you own the place and it’s <the couch> literally in your freaking house.”

For a lack of a better term, I had a “moment” then.  I knew I had her.  She was leaning into me, pawing for my attention, vying for my affection.  She was in my world, and was thankful to be a part of it.  How did it come to this?

Several months ago, when we were nowhere near serious, I casually brought up my blog to Holly.  I mentioned how I have a weekly column at ROK, that I get a lot of emails, and that I like to help guys (and girls) figure out their dating lives and give advice.  She started laughing.  She then asked if I was seeing other girls.  I said yes.  She was shocked and started laughing again.  Then said something along the lines of, “You’re lying!  You’re such a nice guy and you’re a computer nerd!  How are you possibly qualified to give advice?!”  Note, this was all done in good taste, though it sounds bad when writing characters on a screen.

So she really thought I was just some dorky computer nerd who had no game and eyes for no one but her.  I guess sometimes it’s okay to come in under the radar a bit.

I’m telling this story because it’s important for the background of her asking for commitment.  Prior to Wednesday night, she had never seen me out at a bar except if we were just grabbing a drink.  She had never seen me out in a large group of people, had never seen my “game” so to speak.  So what do you think happened?  Naturally, her parents loved me and her mom begged me to stay another day last night.  I charmed the shit out of her dozen girlfriends that came out to the bar, and made good friends and shot some pool with the guys.  I ignored her for a very large chunk of the night, and mingled amongst everybody; making friends, answering questions about her and I, and just generally being the cool, socially capable guy that everybody likes.  Thank fucking God for game!

Holly never saw it coming.  Poor girl never had a chance.

Back to the couch.  We’re approaching the end of the night.  I’m at such ease with myself, and my environment, I’m literally sprawled across the couch.  I’ve got my legs up and I’m taking up half of it, leaning back like a king overlooking his kingdom.  Holly is cuddled up next to me and in her slightly buzzed state is becoming quite talkative…about me.  About how she feels about me, how she loves that I made such good friends with everyone and could mingle around, and that…she thinks she wants more, but doesn’t know for sure, she’s confused.  I ask her flat out what she wants from me, and she says that she wants monogamy, but not the title.  I chuckle and tell her that with monogamy typically comes the boyfriend/girlfriend title.  Eventually, she fesses up that she really likes me and would like to be with just me, but doesn’t want to force me into anything I’m not ready for.  She says that I’m enough for her that she won’t want to see other people (and hasn’t been for a while, unbeknownst to me).  I decide while she’s spilling her heart that it’s okay to turn off the alpha and throw her a bone, admitting that I have been seeing “less” other girls because she has become more interesting and important to me.  This isn’t a lie, but I attribute part of that due to the increasingly cold weather and increased productivity in my writing of late.

I throw out open relationships, stating that I’d like her to be my only girl who I do the “relationship stuff” with, i.e. going to dinners, mutual friends, and date things.  Basically anything that involves money, hah!  She thinks on it for a bit and says that she simply won’t be able to handle it.  She’s too jealous.

The problem is she’s too wishy-washy, which I expected.  I can see right through it though: she wants to be with me, but is terrified of demanding outright commitment because she doesn’t want to scare me off.  The curse of it all is, that if I do commit, she automatically loses some level of attraction to me.  Isn’t biology screwed up?

To wrap this up, in the end, I turned the masculinity back on and made a firm decision.  I told her I wasn’t going to commit yet, but that I would like to start seeing more of her and see what happens, which isn’t a lie.  Rather than once a week, I told her we were going to start seeing each other two to three times a week and I would see how that went.  In addition, I’d like to start bringing her around some of my friends, and even invited her to spend a couple days prior to Christmas with my family.  Of course, she was scared of that, because when I met her whole family *I* was in the spotlight and it makes her nervous to be in the same position I was.

Why?  Because I’m her rock in life.  The steady one during her roller coaster of emotions.  The one that can handle the tough social situations thrown my way, and bat them off in such a way that I’m comfortable enough to sprawl across a couch in a bar with a gin and tonic and smirk, knowing that my life is pretty damn good.

  • Sploosh says:

    Good work. I’ve had similar talks with kaitlyn. At the end of the day, the happiness i bring to her life on a daily basis outweighs the feelings of jealousy that creep up once in a while.

    • Totally hits home for me & Sploosh haha. I’ve been his main girl for a few months now, never flat out asked for exclusive commitment, but obviously he knows I’d prefer that. From the beginning J has said no relationships so I battled a lot between wanting the best man I’ve ever been with (but feeling cripplingly jealous) and wanting commitment from a lesser everything. I was naive at first, when my feelings grew deeper and I became aware of the full situation the decision became much harder. But yes, at the end of the day I always choose J, for so many reasons. I think you can absolutely make it work with one main girl and game on the side. This way you have the benefit of a loyal, doting woman to wait on you and do anything for you (plus insanely reliable source of sex), but still have the freedom and exhilaration of “the chase” with others. I won’t lie, its fucking difficult. I’ve felt some of the deepest hurt I ever have, but it can’t compare to the infinite happiness I feel constantly.

      See how it goes with her, and the more comfortable you get with each other, feel each other out on if this is a partnership that could fit into the lifestyle YOU want – and if it seems like it’s something she can handle. I recommend as much honestly as possible/appropriate – you shouldn’t deceive and manipulate a woman in that situation, she should fully understand her place and the entire scope of your relationship and be okay with it. Down the road you’ll have to work to make it, but if you can it’s totally worth it.

      I could talk for hours about this because I’ve lived through it, if you ever want a girls perspective from this situation, don’t hesitate to ask. I won’t put words in J’s mouth, but I love the situation we are in, and I think it’s something to aspire to. Maybe not for everyone, but definitely for a man who wants the benefits of a main girl.

      • Question…how did it come about? Did you just sort of fall into it or was there an explicit talk that defined it as such?

      • Good question! After dating for 2-3 months, J and I had already been hanging out multiple times a week and I already fallen for him. I brought it up by drunk crying in the middle of a Vegas casino 4th of July weekend haha – classic girl move. I told him I was confused and thought I should leave him because my feelings for him were getting too strong. At this point it wasn’t about commitment, it was about long-term-ness. I realized the longer I was with him the more I’d hurt when I couldn’t see him anymore. J didn’t say too much back that night, but when we got back home he brought it up again and basically told me that it will hurt either way, so why not be the happiest you’ve ever been for longer. He left the decision to me. I would imagine this is a cut off for many of the types of relationships players have – keep a girl around for a couple months, when she can’t handle it, she bails out, she is replaced. But choosing to stay after each successive speed bump is what creates the kind of relationship J and I have.

        I’ve had similar breakdowns at each progressive stage of our relationship haha. Every couple of months I’m forced to reevaluate the situation, I usually cry about it, then we come out stronger. I’ve always been the one to bring up these kinds of talks – men are simple, if he still invites me out I know he’s happy, women have all these stupid uncontrollable emotions that psyche us out unfortunately haha. Each subsequent “talk” we have moves us forward, but are also more deeply rooted. The next time we talked I was concerned with his lifestyle and how I would fit in. I didn’t want to be used or look like a fool for being with a man who had my permission to sleep with other girls. J told me he would keep me as long as I wanted to be with him still (my needing exclusive commitment or wanting children being the dealbreakers).

        I feel like you probably won’t have to ever bring it up, she definitely will when she starts to stew about it like us women can’t help but do. When she does, you don’t have to compromise, stick to what you’ve told her from the beginning. It’s her decision to stay (assuming you still want her to). That was pretty long, I hope that answered your question somewhat haha

  • Tin Man says:

    As the story illustrates, it’s never about them, it’s about you. They (women) are either into you and want more, or they don’t. No control over their ever changing emotional state. You (Men) have to make the decision that it’s our frame, not theirs. For most Men (and myself included), it’s a slippery slope – because we have not learned the basic tenant – “It’s all about Me”. Women really don’t want it to be about them, when they are with someone they are attracted to (or want to be attracted to).

    Great stuff my Man.

  • I’m curious about something…being a girl who thinks that this kind of situation is bullshit and not wanting to ever settle for anything like that, I can still respect where you’re at and that you’re not interested in commitment. So why do you keep seeing the same girls? I don’t see what the pull is, if you’re not interested in actually staying with them?

    • I THOUGHT YOU DIED! I haven’t seen new posts from you in forever! You just made my day. Things have changed a lot around here since you last commented…

      I am interested in staying with them. This one in particular. She’s grown on me a ton. As I said…I’d like her to be my girlfriend, but I’d like to still game on the side. I’ve worked too hard to just give that up.

      • Hahaha nope…I’m alive and well, just got really busy with work and school and a new boyfriend.

        I guess your mentality is just foreign to me….if she’s so unworthy of your respect that you still feel the need to pursue and fuck other girls, why is she worth your time in the first place?
        You seem to smart to go after girls who are unintelligent and/or don’t respect themselves.
        Then again, you are a bit of an arrogant prick…so maybe the smart ones see you coming!!

      • *too smart. Apparently I can’t spell when on my phone.

      • @olive: I respect the shit out of this girl. I genuinely like her. I also understand enough about attraction to know that as soon as I commit, and she’s the only vagina I have access to, her attraction goes down.

        @tin: it’s all about the edge. I’m writing another post about this, goes live tomorrow morning.

      • Tiffany says:

        I think she’s attracted to the fact that you are capable of accessing other vaginas, not that you actively do so. Yes, you’ve worked hard to be where you’re at. Committing doesn’t mean you lose that. If it doesn’t work out, you still have your game. Honesty is the best policy, with yourself especially. And you honestly sound like you really like this girl.

    • Tin Man says:

      Love is a chemical reaction – nothing magical about it. Sex (and sexual tension) create that chemical – and then a whole truck load floods your body during the act of sex.

      Love is not an emotion – “love” biological.

      That being said, think about about your prior relationship and look at how attracted or unattracted you were to that Man. Chemical will only take you so far – and if that Man starts to act in a way that is different from when you met (i.e. giving in, saying yes instead of no, focusing on you only, not daring to flirt with other woman, etc.) then some of the edge if comes off. It happens all the time – there are cycles within a “relationship” there is nothing you can do about it.

      The post is about being a Man, that retains his edge, even IF he wants to continue in a LTR with a woman. The edge is maintain by being a Man – by being sexual, by being on mission, by allowing a woman in your life, but not making the woman your life. At the point the center of a Man’s life shifts to a woman – is the same point where the attraction begins to ebb and slowing flow out.

      Like I said, think about your past relationship – the ones that were so intense to begin with, but then faded. What happened? And be honest with yourself, not looking for you to answer publicly, just for you have a bit of self reflection.

      • Haha, clearly we haven’t met….I’m an open book! And I’ve never had a relationship that was above board, excepting the one I’m in now(so far). There’s nothing ‘manly’ about not committing to someone. But you’re absolutely right, no relationship should be the center of your life. There must be two separate people, supporting one another. I’m not saying that ‘game’ is a bad thing in general, I just don’t think a good woman should take you seriously or commit to you while you continue to play the field.

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